Well, everyone I know loves target. Especially women.
I'd say that this is a step in the right direction for suburban development. Notice that all of the parking is behind and between the buildings. This will at least present a much more attractive view from the main streets than a massive parking lot would.
- 11K
[sarcasm] It's just beautiful! I can't wait to load up the little red wagon and Jr. and spend the day! [/sarcasm off].
Why must they build a new St. Louis Promenade with a few more trees?! Put the frickin' water and trees inside the complex and have people park on the outside!!!! Stupid. Their parking lot sucks.
Why must they build a new St. Louis Promenade with a few more trees?! Put the frickin' water and trees inside the complex and have people park on the outside!!!! Stupid. Their parking lot sucks.
^Unless I'm missing your point, "people parking on the outside" means another suburban-style strip-mall set back behind a sea of parking. So yes, I'd much prefer "a new St. Louis Promenade with a few more trees".
If you look closely, they've just masked the way the structures are set up. They are still only accessible by car, Unless you see some sort of sidewalk access that I'm missing.
They've built up a wall of green around the block, with only two entrances. Both entrances take you to the middle...the parking lot. I'm sure all the buildings will have entrances that are only accessible from the front...by the parking lot.
Great project.
They've built up a wall of green around the block, with only two entrances. Both entrances take you to the middle...the parking lot. I'm sure all the buildings will have entrances that are only accessible from the front...by the parking lot.
Great project.
Quick thoughts...
Town and Country must make sure that those buildings fronting the lake will acutaly have enterances along the lake walkway, as is shown on the rendering.
Secondly, I am sad to see the meadow area along the western edge will be developed. I had hoped that it would be reforested.
Thrid, while the lake is a nice start, the site design could be much better done. If the wester portion of the site is going to be dominated by residential, they could have chosen to better link the commerical and residential portions of the development. As currently shown, few from the adjacent residential (let along the apartments across Clayton) will walk into the new development. Throw the target where buildings N and M are shown with a plaza space between the Target and buildings K through F. Locate the target parking as where shown now. Maybe consider a small deck or some condos over the single story commerical. The potential was (and still is) there. Town and Country just wasn't smart enough to demand it. How sad...
Town and Country must make sure that those buildings fronting the lake will acutaly have enterances along the lake walkway, as is shown on the rendering.
Secondly, I am sad to see the meadow area along the western edge will be developed. I had hoped that it would be reforested.
Thrid, while the lake is a nice start, the site design could be much better done. If the wester portion of the site is going to be dominated by residential, they could have chosen to better link the commerical and residential portions of the development. As currently shown, few from the adjacent residential (let along the apartments across Clayton) will walk into the new development. Throw the target where buildings N and M are shown with a plaza space between the Target and buildings K through F. Locate the target parking as where shown now. Maybe consider a small deck or some condos over the single story commerical. The potential was (and still is) there. Town and Country just wasn't smart enough to demand it. How sad...
- 11K
^Unless I'm missing your point, "people parking on the outside" means another suburban-style strip-mall set back behind a sea of parking. So yes, I'd much prefer "a new St. Louis Promenade with a few more trees".
I think they would do better to place the stores in closer proximity to one another so that you could park and walk from Target to whatever bistro by the lake. the retail establishments are too spread out. This is the same problem with the Promenade. If there were a large (20+ ft) walkway across the parking lot it might be a bearable (and safe) walk.
New Town and Country shopping center emphasizes the outdoors
By Gail Appleson
ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH
03/20/2008
Town and Country Crossing, which makes its debut in June with the opening of the area's newest Whole Foods Market, is the latest example of a shopping center that emphasizes landscaped outdoor walking, mingling and eating areas instead of enclosed mall space.
In fact, outdoor space is so important to the 45-acre development that it contains an almost three-acre lake. This is the largest water feature of any St. Louis retail center, its developers say. The landscaping will include more than 1,200 trees and 5,000 shrubs.
"The goal was to create something unique to St. Louis," said Ted Levis, principal of TNC Investors, the developer behind the center. "We've taken great pains to create something environmentally pleasing to look at."
TNC is made up of Emerald Properties Group of St. Louis, Amerimar Enterprises Inc. of Philadelphia and Angelo, Gordon & Co. of New York.
The 310,000-square-foot shopping center is on the former Lucent Technologies campus at the southwest corner of Clayton and Woods Mill roads.
In addition to Whole Foods, other identified tenants are Target, FedEx Kinko's, Des Peres-based Go!Spa, National City Bank and Qdoba Mexican Grill. Developers hope there will be about 40 retailers and that the center will be filled by spring 2009, Levis said.
Although developers are only releasing the names of businesses that have signed leases, Levis said many more are interested and that the economy has not deterred potential occupants.
"We've had great activity," he said. "We haven't seen a slowdown in interest. So far, it hasn't cost us anything."
Source
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By Gail Appleson
ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH
03/20/2008
Town and Country Crossing, which makes its debut in June with the opening of the area's newest Whole Foods Market, is the latest example of a shopping center that emphasizes landscaped outdoor walking, mingling and eating areas instead of enclosed mall space.
In fact, outdoor space is so important to the 45-acre development that it contains an almost three-acre lake. This is the largest water feature of any St. Louis retail center, its developers say. The landscaping will include more than 1,200 trees and 5,000 shrubs.
"The goal was to create something unique to St. Louis," said Ted Levis, principal of TNC Investors, the developer behind the center. "We've taken great pains to create something environmentally pleasing to look at."
TNC is made up of Emerald Properties Group of St. Louis, Amerimar Enterprises Inc. of Philadelphia and Angelo, Gordon & Co. of New York.
The 310,000-square-foot shopping center is on the former Lucent Technologies campus at the southwest corner of Clayton and Woods Mill roads.
In addition to Whole Foods, other identified tenants are Target, FedEx Kinko's, Des Peres-based Go!Spa, National City Bank and Qdoba Mexican Grill. Developers hope there will be about 40 retailers and that the center will be filled by spring 2009, Levis said.
Although developers are only releasing the names of businesses that have signed leases, Levis said many more are interested and that the economy has not deterred potential occupants.
"We've had great activity," he said. "We haven't seen a slowdown in interest. So far, it hasn't cost us anything."
Source
I'm curious about buildings F through K. Assuming the main entrances face the parking lot, and there's a landscaped patio area facing the lake, then where will the businesses receive their deliveries? Where are the trash bins? Or have they in fact moved the storefronts around to the lakeside, thereby forcing the Suburbanites to completely lose sight of their cars during their shopping "experience"?
A lot of progress has been made here.
The pond is filled up. The Whole Foods just opened for business. The Target sign is up on their building. And the smaller lakeside buildings are nearing completion. Building H or J has a Qdoba sign in the window.
The pond is filled up. The Whole Foods just opened for business. The Target sign is up on their building. And the smaller lakeside buildings are nearing completion. Building H or J has a Qdoba sign in the window.
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I wonder if Gail Appelson has been back to visit T&C since it opened
(see glowing article above). I stopped by today and was not impressed. If you shop at Target you will need to get back into your car drive across the oversized (empty) parking lot and repark to shop at another big box. It is not pedestrian friendly. Stores are haphazardly placed so you can not just stop in to the next place. I would spend 1/2 my day just moving my car around the lot.
Correct me if I am wrong but shouldn't new urbanism encourage walking and discourage the car?!?!
By the way, what about all of those interested stores? It looks pretty empy out there...
(see glowing article above). I stopped by today and was not impressed. If you shop at Target you will need to get back into your car drive across the oversized (empty) parking lot and repark to shop at another big box. It is not pedestrian friendly. Stores are haphazardly placed so you can not just stop in to the next place. I would spend 1/2 my day just moving my car around the lot.
Correct me if I am wrong but shouldn't new urbanism encourage walking and discourage the car?!?!
By the way, what about all of those interested stores? It looks pretty empy out there...
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This isn't new urbanism or a lifestyle center, just a spruced up conventional suburban strip center. And yes, new urbanism or a lifestyle center focus more on the convenience of walking and not driving in order to provide a sense of place.
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"shopping center that emphasizes landscaped outdoor walking, mingling and eating areas instead of enclosed mall space"
PD- article
Just wondering about that walking comment... Maybe they will set up a maze in the parking lot.
And mingling??? With who? The SUV driver that just ran you over because you were on your outdoor walk?
SMS - you are correct it is just a strip center.
PD- article
Just wondering about that walking comment... Maybe they will set up a maze in the parking lot.
And mingling??? With who? The SUV driver that just ran you over because you were on your outdoor walk?
SMS - you are correct it is just a strip center.
- 5,433
SMSPlanstu wrote:This isn't new urbanism or a lifestyle center, just a spruced up conventional suburban strip center. And yes, new urbanism or a lifestyle center focus more on the convenience of walking and not driving in order to provide a sense of place.
I was hoping for a game-changing development, then I woke up and realized I'm still in St. Louis.
I don't go to West County frequently anyway, so it won't affect me much, but I see this as another missed opportunity.
- 8,922
I too see this as yet another missed opportunity. I emailed Gail requesting a follow up article.